View Poll Results: What is your religion?

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  • Atheism

    71 21.71%
  • Agnosticism

    48 14.68%
  • Buddhism

    4 1.22%
  • Christianity

    166 50.76%
  • Deism

    6 1.83%
  • Hinduism

    1 0.31%
  • Islam

    7 2.14%
  • Judaism

    6 1.83%
  • Nature religion

    2 0.61%
  • Neopaganism

    1 0.31%
  • Other

    19 5.81%
  • Other monotheism or henotheism

    2 0.61%
  • Other polytheism

    2 0.61%
  • Sikhism

    0 0%
  • Unaffiliated spiritualism

    12 3.67%
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Thread: What's Your Religion?

  1. #1026
    Consistent In My Inconsistency PizzaGuy's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Superninfreak View Post
    I'm just pointing out that rejecting a literal interpretation of the Bible isn't the same as rejecting a deity in any form.

    Christianity is a very diverse faith, and beliefs about God are even more diverse. It's hasty to reject all those schools of thought because you dislike one interpretation of one religion.

    It should also be noted that even Catholicism doesn't believe the entire bible is literal (since they believe in Theistic Evolution).
    Okay. I've completely changed my strategy. I really can't disprove his existence, nor can I prove it. My reason as to why I believe he doesn't exist is, "When in doubt, don't."
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    It's a shotgun opera and the fat lady is singing tonight Forum Veteran Eruedraith's Avatar
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  3. #1028
    I whip my mane back and forth (again) Dinosaurshotgun's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    I agree with much of this, but not #4 - I would say there are NO good people on EITHER side. Part of the gospel is that we're all sinners in need of forgiveness, which is why Jesus got the most ticked off at the people that thought they were better than everyone else (pharisees) and tended to hang out with people that recognized exactly why they sucked at life.

    And then on the atheist side, "good" has (usually) a relative meaning, so you could even say there are no "good" people there, too (depending on your definition).

  4. #1029
    It's a shotgun opera and the fat lady is singing tonight Forum Veteran Eruedraith's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Uh, what?

    Yeah, we're all sinners. Yeah, we're not perfect. The article was using the word 'good' to describe well-meaning, kind, moral people, which there is an abundance of on either side. So in that sense, yes, there are good people on both sides.

  5. #1030
    I whip my mane back and forth (again) Dinosaurshotgun's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eruedraith View Post
    Uh, what?

    Yeah, we're all sinners. Yeah, we're not perfect. The article was using the word 'good' to describe well-meaning, kind, moral people, which there is an abundance of on either side. So in that sense, yes, there are good people on both sides.
    Nah, I would say everyone is basically bad, even people that you think are good. Just read Paul's letters and you'll know what I'm talking about.

    Basically, for a list of things that both sides must agree on, that doesn't fit, because total depravity of mankind is sort of a part of Christianity.

  6. #1031
    Putting a cap in your benefits Forum Moderator Superninfreak's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Eh, that article isn't as great as you make it sound. It seems to act like things like creationism are things most christians believe, and I don't like the implication that atheists act out of a culturally ingrained belief in God. He also completely misunderstands determinism.

    David Wong has his moments, but I think that article was kinda shallow.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dinosaurshotgun View Post
    Nah, I would say everyone is basically bad, even people that you think are good. Just read Paul's letters and you'll know what I'm talking about.

    Basically, for a list of things that both sides must agree on, that doesn't fit, because total depravity of mankind is sort of a part of Christianity.
    I think you're taking that doctrine further than most people do. No one is perfect, but people do have shades of good. If there was nothing good in anyone there wouldn't be any examples of self sacrifice in human history.
    Last edited by Superninfreak; May 7th, 2012 at 08:37 PM.
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  7. #1032
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    I'm a Christian and I agree to "no one is perfect, but we have shades of good."
    I also feel bad for the well meaning members of my faith due to the hypocrites and misguided being more active/acknowledged.
    I hope I one day can count as a well meaning member of my faith, but I feel it will take both God's help and me willing to listen to him to get there.
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  8. #1033
    Frauds are people too... people who just can't win. Forum Veteran Deathfish64's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dinosaurshotgun View Post
    Nah, I would say everyone is basically bad, even people that you think are good. Just read Paul's letters and you'll know what I'm talking about.

    Basically, for a list of things that both sides must agree on, that doesn't fit, because total depravity of mankind is sort of a part of Christianity.
    I was under the impression that total depravity was a very Calvinist notion and not something that even a majority of Christians really accepted. If it weren't special in any way, then it wouldn't be notable as a part of TULIP, after all.

    Anyway, that article is okay, but I can definitely see it as gravitating towards theism at times and that really throws off the intention of creating common ground.


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  9. #1034
    Tornado Remix Lightningdork
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathfish64 View Post
    Anyway, that article is okay, but I can definitely see it as gravitating towards theism at times and that really throws off the intention of creating common ground.
    Pretty much my views of it. At times he shows total ignorance to atheist views and makes really faulty comparisons as a result. The bit on justice comes to mind in point 3... His examples don't even fit the overall point, let alone not having any correlation to one another. He was so focused on this really contrived "well if you want justice, you want this invisible hand dictating what is right!" notion (no, justice is a human contract in a fair few atheists' minds, that's not even slightly close to divine command in any way) whereas the only thing against Christians was was "we don't pray to get our car fixed!" That's just not a good comparison at all, saying that Christians use mechanics while atheists occasionally think that other people do things that are wrong and require justice (when we think that justice is something created by human interactions and agreements). Honestly the fact that he spent so long trying to justify that "point" about atheists said to me that he didn't know what he was talking about. His overall message in that part was totally lost.


    And I can't say I comprehend this "everyone is terrible" thing. Yes it's a matter of opinion Dino but I have never met another atheist who has said that there are no good people anywhere ever. They may exist, but I certainly haven't seen them; when talking about the majority I don't think using fringe viewpoints really works as an overarching counter. As for your Christian view on it... So not even the quality of trying to live sin-free and atoning for what you do gives you any degree of goodness? You're just as wretched as, say, a murderer or rapist? I don't see how that'd be anything but an incredibly depressing way to live life. You can't do anything generous or involving self-sacrifice (correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that self-sacrifice was kind of a big deal in Christianity) to be in the slightest degree "better" than intentionally harmful people?
    Last edited by Lightningboalt; May 8th, 2012 at 09:19 AM.
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  10. #1035
    I whip my mane back and forth (again) Dinosaurshotgun's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightningboalt View Post
    As for your Christian view on it... So not even the quality of trying to live sin-free and atoning for what you do gives you any degree of goodness? You're just as wretched as, say, a murderer or rapist? I don't see how that'd be anything but an incredibly depressing way to live life. You can't do anything generous or involving self-sacrifice (correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that self-sacrifice was kind of a big deal in Christianity) to be in the slightest degree "better" than intentionally harmful people?
    I'll explain why it's not depressing.

    The good news of the gospel is that, despite our great sin, God has great forgiveness, and transforms us into those that would spread his love to others in our testimony and our charity. Paul called himself the chief of sinners, because he knew himself better than he knew anyone else and what he saw was that when he tried to do everything on his own, he would end up being very selfish and not treating others as Jesus would have. If you actually look at Paul's life, you see that he has an impressive resume as far as ministry goes... but everyone has their dark secrets, even if they don't admit to them, that make them, overall, full of sin. Even Mother Teresa had doubts about her own salvation. I truly believe that she was not lying to herself when she noticed sin in her life (even if nobody else noticed it).

    If Paul or me or anyone else considers our good deeds to make us better than any other person, then that's a corrupt understanding of God's word. Our good deeds do not come from ourselves, they come only by the grace of God (including common grace). Not having to worry about being better than anyone, and just having the heart of a servant, is a truly liberating feeling. It brings humble joy during the good times, and comfort during the bad times. When I'm in a bad mood or being inconsiderate (surely you're aware of that side of me), it's because I lose sight of this and start to think of myself too much. I legitimately hope you can all experience at one point or another the freedom of humility, I've "tasted" it (if that makes any sense) and people that are more humbled than I seem to be happier.

  11. #1036
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    mother teresa literally caused suffering in sick people because of her religious beliefs though

    yes being a servant truly is the most liberating of feelings, this makes for a fulfilling life and has no problems whatsoever, i feel some hegel needs to be read

    congrats on tasting it, where do you get your horses dinosaur? I'd like to get one too.
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  12. #1037
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by cyanide_ View Post
    mother teresa literally caused suffering in sick people because of her religious beliefs though
    I did just a little basic reading on this. Would you say it was to a bad enough extent to disregard or counteract the amount of good she did to help the same people, also in the name of religious beliefs? It sounds like her efforts in helping people are what she's most renowned for.

    Quote Originally Posted by cyanide_ View Post
    yes being a servant truly is the most liberating of feelings, this makes for a fulfilling life and has no problems whatsoever, i feel some hegel needs to be read

    congrats on tasting it, where do you get your horses dinosaur? I'd like to get one too.
     
    I feel like you're hinting at something, but this comes across more as just making a sarcastic remark about a viewpoint that's different from yours. Are you thinking of any specific problems that go with a humble or servant-like mindset or lifestyle?

  13. #1038
    Putting a cap in your benefits Forum Moderator Superninfreak's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Unfortunately if you do some digging into people who you think are paragons of virtue you find out that they had a dark side.

    Hell, using Dino's example of Paul, before Paul converted he went around persecuting Christians.
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  14. #1039
    resident asshole cyanide_'s Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    I just wouldn't hold up Mother Teresa as a saint, and the bad things that she would recognise herself probably wouldn't be those things that caused suffering in the ill because of her fundamentalist beliefs. Of course she did plenty of good things, and really don't know if one cancels out the other. I was just knocking down the common myth of Mother Teresa.

    People can hold different viewpoint of my own. What I dislike is the tone that some people use, there's something deeply patronising about this sentence:

    "I legitimately hope you can all experience at one point or another the freedom of humility, I've "tasted" it"

    Think about horses and height.

    And I do think there are legitimate problems with subservient lifestyles that I can happily debate whilst respecting the other persons beliefs and line of argument. Something something about workers and chains.
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  15. #1040
    Putting a cap in your benefits Forum Moderator Superninfreak's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by cyanide_ View Post
    Think about horses and height.
    Huh? I'm not sure what you mean by this.
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  16. #1041
    It's a shotgun opera and the fat lady is singing tonight Forum Veteran Eruedraith's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Superninfreak View Post
    Huh? I'm not sure what you mean by this.
    He's referring to the phrase 'Get off your high horse'.

  17. #1042
    I whip my mane back and forth (again) Dinosaurshotgun's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Now it sounds like you think I'm saying that I'm better than other people, or I'm misunderstanding your criticism? What I'm saying is the opposite, that in those moments where I'm not thinking all about myself it's very liberating, the kind of feeling you want to share with other people. I'm not trying to make people like me, I would prefer that not to be the case but I want people to share in an experience that I've had before. I'm not sure about how else to express it...

  18. #1043
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    I think cyanide was looking at your post as "I've had the good fortune to be able to be selfless, I hope you selfish jerks have the same chance some day".

    I think what you actually meant was more along the lines of "Whenever I don't think of myself I feel much happier, and I'm glad my faith helps me keep my focus on that".
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  19. #1044
    resident asshole cyanide_'s Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Added to that it's the seemingly certain tone that dinosaur has found the One True Way of life, and he hopes we can all find this hallowed path too.

    I know you mean know malice with your comments dinosaur but there is a certainty that doesn't sit well with me, and a patronising tone(although I do think this part is only down to tone and a small change in rhetoric alters it easily).
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  20. #1045
    Tornado Remix Lightningdork
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dinosaurshotgun View Post
    Now it sounds like you think I'm saying that I'm better than other people, or I'm misunderstanding your criticism? What I'm saying is the opposite, that in those moments where I'm not thinking all about myself it's very liberating, the kind of feeling you want to share with other people. I'm not trying to make people like me, I would prefer that not to be the case but I want people to share in an experience that I've had before. I'm not sure about how else to express it...
    The way that you've discussed this makes it appear that you believe humility is something that only Christians can achieve by doing things in service to god. It may not be what you intended, but the air of that sentence (which I have to agree I found patronizing as well) gives that impression.

    I'm totally fine if people are proud of their beliefs but the feeling of being looked down upon for your own beliefs is never a pleasant one. It seems a bit contradictory to claim humility but to also act as if your beliefs are the one true way and how you wish others could be similarly enlightened.
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  21. #1046
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    I've been debating with myself for a while now about religion. And now, I consider myself agnostic, as I don't see how either side of atheism or theism can use physical evidence to try and prove or disprove a supernatural being. And to be honest, I find being agnostic easier to have religious debates with both religious and atheistic because they don't seem to believe that I am a threat to their beliefs (I'm not too antagonistic on either side, both have their strengths and weaknesses).

    And, to be honest, I'm relieved that my friends are accepting of that. It shows that I chose my friends well.

  22. #1047
    there's math and there's dealers and players and killers and me Dragon's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    I'd also probably describe myself as agnostic, but I am not going around rubbing people's faces in it. The people I hang out with don't talk about religion very much, so my faith never surfaces. I also am not going to try and tell you about what I believe. You can believe whatever you want, and I will do the same.

  23. #1048
    Consistent In My Inconsistency PizzaGuy's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Hey guys, could any Christians here help me with something? Do you believe that if you don't make it to heaven, you spend eternity in hell? Because in the Bible, it says a few times that "Everlasting life" is to be earned. That you are rewarded it for being a model Christian. So, my question is, what happens to your soul in hell if that's the case? Does it just fade away?
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  24. #1049
    Putting a cap in your benefits Forum Moderator Superninfreak's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Hell is discussed in incredibly vague terms in the Bible, but it's important to note that Hell is usually compared with death, while Heaven is compared with life.

    Some Christians believe that Hell is non-existance, some believe that Hell is eternal torment (although I don't really get how someone can believe that), and some people have other ideas.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annihilationism
    Last edited by Superninfreak; April 2nd, 2013 at 12:17 PM.
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  25. #1050
    Consistent In My Inconsistency PizzaGuy's Avatar
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    Re: What's Your Religion?

    Thanks, I think I have a better idea now. I also agree with you completely.
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